Forum Home > Battle Videos > Battle Video Archives
Too Hyphy!!: Is Battle Rap A Sustainable Business Model Currently?


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 04-02-2014, 10:23 PM   #1
Vanilla
Original RMBVA Dondatta
 
Vanilla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 4,021
Mentioned: 729 Post(s)
Vanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time Antarctica
Too Hyphy!!: Is Battle Rap A Sustainable Business Model Currently?

It's crazy cause we talk a lot about who's getting paid what and how much the leagues are pulling in....


but as far as a battle rap league goes as a sustainable business with longevity, does it make sense as an owner?.....

Now, I'm not tryna be all nosy and shit... but Organik said on here that he's lucky...lucky to even walk away with 1500 dollars.... that's an awful cut for a league owner, but he also made a really good point too...

He said something along the lines of, "When all these battlers keep asking for large amounts of money, they kill the long-term growth" (just paraphrasing)


but he's right... with no inward leverage and the NOI (hopefully they have one, I think I heard before that they've taken losses) being abysmal, it kills the valuation of the company and then it makes even harder to sustain booking these battlers at their asking price.



So RMBVA: Do you guys think that battlers demanding these high paychecks will eventually kill any sort of upward momentum? If you were an owner, how would you structure the business?



By the way, Nowhere even close am I shitting on KOTD or saying it can't work--it can and it has, but it seems like it's still kind of stagnant. I see this as a very positive thread that could help KOTD refine their product or at the very least, maybe the can cherry pick one good idea and it'll help.. help battle rap here guys lol
__________________
http://i60.tinypic.com/15gaz6f.jpg

Quote:
Originally Posted by OrganikHipHop View Post
after all of this.. yall will still call us hill billys downplay our role and our history... but it aint gonna change shit
Vanilla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2014, 10:29 PM   #2
Vanilla
Original RMBVA Dondatta
 
Vanilla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 4,021
Mentioned: 729 Post(s)
Vanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time Antarctica
I think a good first step is working out some kind of deal with the battlers...

If the battlers participated in one mega event, and took only 1/3 of their usual asking price, get the PPV cooking, get the door sales going, and then reinvest a good portion of the money into advertising or for the next event, they'd be on fire. Organik is loyal as fuck, almost too loyal sometimes to the point it hurts him, so I know that his word would be as good as a contract when it came to hooking up the battlers in the future when the business was absolutely killing it. He would take care of those that went for the paycuts (ie. like Diz did).
__________________
http://i60.tinypic.com/15gaz6f.jpg

Quote:
Originally Posted by OrganikHipHop View Post
after all of this.. yall will still call us hill billys downplay our role and our history... but it aint gonna change shit
Vanilla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2014, 10:33 PM   #3
Ness Lee
VIP
 
Ness Lee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 2,034
Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Ness Lee is better than Grind Time AustraliaNess Lee is better than Grind Time AustraliaNess Lee is better than Grind Time Australia
from the looks of things battle rap has a terrible business model.

organizers complain about the money they get. battlers complain about the money they get. who is getting the money?
Ness Lee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2014, 10:36 PM   #4
Dunk
Registered User
 
Dunk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Squirt City
Posts: 640
Mentioned: 93 Post(s)
Dunk is a PY Poster
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ness Lee View Post
from the looks of things battle rap has a terrible business model.

organizers complain about the money they get. battlers complain about the money they get. who is getting the money?
the popular battlers and the leagues that know how to exploit them
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by WillyRotel View Post
We arent asking if u r gay... just if u ever "liked" one... like if uve ever had one that u said "boy i like this phaggot here.. hes one handsome phaggot"?

have u ever thought this before!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wickedness View Post
Dont invite ill will back. He is def scared of taking a for sure L to real deal.. u r l rappers can't hang with real emcees.
Dunk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2014, 10:38 PM   #5
Ness Lee
VIP
 
Ness Lee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 2,034
Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Ness Lee is better than Grind Time AustraliaNess Lee is better than Grind Time AustraliaNess Lee is better than Grind Time Australia
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dunk View Post
the popular battlers and the leagues that know how to exploit them
obviously. but with popular leagues and battlers alike recently having monetary gripes....here we are in this thread
Ness Lee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2014, 10:39 PM   #6
brodeezy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 9,384
Mentioned: 627 Post(s)
brodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URL
gotta find a way to break into the PPV model better. only way it can thrive



leagues need to spoil the fuck out of every battle immediately after the ppv so people cant just ignore it till bootlegs come out give dudes reasons to watch it live (or make em scared not to ya hurdd).
but unless u got battle rap stars after battle rap stars on every card (and no, that doesnt include bender or sketch menace) then u wont be able to charge enough per ticket to make a profit based off of attendees


offer the key battlers to a card reasonable % of the ppv so they put effort into marketing it and marketing themselves instead of just a flat rate
__________________
battle rap sucks tbh

I GOTTA REP SO BIG
FOR THE CULTURE: WD7DAY2: https://m.twitch.tv/trappingoutthebandwidth

the voice of The People©
The Peoples© champ

Quote:
Originally Posted by uuuununnn View Post
deezy sorry i had to go somewhere but i am definitely in here
brodeezy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2014, 10:43 PM   #7
brodeezy
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 9,384
Mentioned: 627 Post(s)
brodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URLbrodeezy is on URL
and im not sure what the deal is with online advertisements during ppvs but get those rollin in between rounds n shit. but the ppv model is how they gonna do it they just gotta do it right



UW got the best chance of banking off this shit
__________________
battle rap sucks tbh

I GOTTA REP SO BIG
FOR THE CULTURE: WD7DAY2: https://m.twitch.tv/trappingoutthebandwidth

the voice of The People©
The Peoples© champ

Quote:
Originally Posted by uuuununnn View Post
deezy sorry i had to go somewhere but i am definitely in here
brodeezy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2014, 11:02 PM   #8
Wake
antilluminati
 
Join Date: Aug 2013
Location: Norway
Posts: 1,766
Mentioned: 41 Post(s)
Wake is not the worst person
How about instead of a paycheck, give these battlers royalties off youtube, and percentages off earnings made off event and ppv after incomes break even with costs. It'll make the battlers work harder to promote before and after the event plus work harder to deliver a good battle.
Wake is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2014, 11:09 PM   #9
Dunk
Registered User
 
Dunk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Squirt City
Posts: 640
Mentioned: 93 Post(s)
Dunk is a PY Poster
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ness Lee View Post
obviously. but with popular leagues and battlers alike recently having monetary gripes....here we are in this thread
it's just kotd (a league infamous for saying 'we don't make any money'), and math hoffa (who can't get booked) complaining though

clips had a disagreement with url because they gave him $5,000 instead of $8,000

everything else seems to be fine
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by WillyRotel View Post
We arent asking if u r gay... just if u ever "liked" one... like if uve ever had one that u said "boy i like this phaggot here.. hes one handsome phaggot"?

have u ever thought this before!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wickedness View Post
Dont invite ill will back. He is def scared of taking a for sure L to real deal.. u r l rappers can't hang with real emcees.
Dunk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2014, 11:21 PM   #10
Ness Lee
VIP
 
Ness Lee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 2,034
Mentioned: 27 Post(s)
Ness Lee is better than Grind Time AustraliaNess Lee is better than Grind Time AustraliaNess Lee is better than Grind Time Australia
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dunk View Post
it's just kotd (a league infamous for saying 'we don't make any money'), and math hoffa (who can't get booked) complaining though

clips had a disagreement with url because they gave him $5,000 instead of $8,000

everything else seems to be fine
"seems" being a key word

i feel you though b
Ness Lee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2014, 11:22 PM   #11
Vanilla
Original RMBVA Dondatta
 
Vanilla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 4,021
Mentioned: 729 Post(s)
Vanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time Antarctica
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dunk View Post
it's just kotd (a league infamous for saying 'we don't make any money'), and math hoffa (who can't get booked) complaining though

clips had a disagreement with url because they gave him $5,000 instead of $8,000

everything else seems to be fine
Yeah that's a good point...

imo I think Ganik is way too nice and people took advantage of him... books all people he feels he owes favors too, even though they don't benefit the biz and end up just eating up camera time.

I think another way is trimming the fat....I'm talking like shedding 1500+ pounds of battlers that don't really draw interest or have a fan base. Even if they aren't getting paid, time is still money
__________________
http://i60.tinypic.com/15gaz6f.jpg

Quote:
Originally Posted by OrganikHipHop View Post
after all of this.. yall will still call us hill billys downplay our role and our history... but it aint gonna change shit
Vanilla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-02-2014, 11:59 PM   #12
My Kall
Registered User
 
My Kall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 3,474
Mentioned: 76 Post(s)
My Kall is better than Grind Time AustraliaMy Kall is better than Grind Time Australia
A publicly limited corporation could turn Battle-Rap into a cash-cow, and it would be like the TV industry/music industry. Independently Battle-Rap could be sustainable, here's some ideas how:

KOTD/Don't Flop/URL, as independent leagues, could:
- Charge MUCH higher ticket prices.
- Charge people to franchise the league's name and branding.
- Pay battlers less, use more up & comers, like Ty Law, who won't demand as much money.
- Stop flying so many people across the country or internationally, focus on cultivating local talent.
- Learn your market demographics, and then solicit sponsors, who are targeting those audiences. (part of the problem is that battle-rap might not be watched by one definitive demographic)
- Do more one-off battles at other peoples events, maybe go to some kind of entertainment exhibition or Hip-Hop festival.
- Sell some high view videos that are no longer getting many views, basically flog them for more than they're worth.

With the new profits, they should buy some non-current assets. If they made these purchases, banks would lend them credit no problem, AND if they needed to quickly raise cash they could sell them, maybe for more than they paid for depending on inflation rates.

The sustainability of it partly depends on where the league owners and staff live. If they live in poor small towns, they won't need as much money to spend on living costs, BUT if the owners live in places like NYC or London, then they'll have to withdraw as much of the profit as they can just to get by. I would suggest moving to cheaper towns.
My Kall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 12:22 AM   #13
My Kall
Registered User
 
My Kall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 3,474
Mentioned: 76 Post(s)
My Kall is better than Grind Time AustraliaMy Kall is better than Grind Time Australia
Another possibility would be for KOTD/URL/UW/Flip-Top/Don't Flop to merge into one huge independent organization. This would integrate all the markets, and banks would be MUCH more confident about lending credit to a diversified amalgamation of businesses, because if one brand was failing, another brand might be succeeding.
My Kall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 12:26 AM   #14
Vanilla
Original RMBVA Dondatta
 
Vanilla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 4,021
Mentioned: 729 Post(s)
Vanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time Antarctica
Quote:
Originally Posted by brodeezy View Post
gotta find a way to break into the PPV model better. only way it can thrive



leagues need to spoil the fuck out of every battle immediately after the ppv so people cant just ignore it till bootlegs come out give dudes reasons to watch it live (or make em scared not to ya hurdd).
but unless u got battle rap stars after battle rap stars on every card (and no, that doesnt include bender or sketch menace) then u wont be able to charge enough per ticket to make a profit based off of attendees


offer the key battlers to a card reasonable % of the ppv so they put effort into marketing it and marketing themselves instead of just a flat rate

Agreeeeed.... They gotta somehow monetize that ppv and take full advantage of it...

and they need to start charging more for tickets at the door.. cause the people that are gonna be paying more are probably more serious about battling and who you want in the crowd
__________________
http://i60.tinypic.com/15gaz6f.jpg

Quote:
Originally Posted by OrganikHipHop View Post
after all of this.. yall will still call us hill billys downplay our role and our history... but it aint gonna change shit
Vanilla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 12:34 AM   #15
Vanilla
Original RMBVA Dondatta
 
Vanilla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 4,021
Mentioned: 729 Post(s)
Vanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time Antarctica
Quote:
Originally Posted by My Kall View Post
Another possibility would be for KOTD/URL/UW/Flip-Top/Don't Flop to merge into one huge independent organization. This would integrate all the markets, and banks would be MUCH more confident about lending credit to a diversified amalgamation of businesses, because if one brand was failing, another brand might be succeeding.
lmaoooo dead @ the thought of da rebel, organik, smack, and eurgh in a conference room discussing the next event...that would be amazing
__________________
http://i60.tinypic.com/15gaz6f.jpg

Quote:
Originally Posted by OrganikHipHop View Post
after all of this.. yall will still call us hill billys downplay our role and our history... but it aint gonna change shit
Vanilla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 12:36 AM   #16
SpecialOh
©
 
SpecialOh's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 13,833
Mentioned: 1155 Post(s)
SpecialOh is a vet in their local leagueSpecialOh is a vet in their local leagueSpecialOh is a vet in their local leagueSpecialOh is a vet in their local leagueSpecialOh is a vet in their local leagueSpecialOh is a vet in their local leagueSpecialOh is a vet in their local leagueSpecialOh is a vet in their local leagueSpecialOh is a vet in their local league
they should have an event where every battler pays to be there

and they spend all that money on drinks for the fans
SpecialOh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 02:30 PM   #17
KebertXela
after school pottery star
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 926
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
KebertXela is not the worst person
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanillaNigga View Post
Yeah that's a good point...

imo I think Ganik is way too nice and people took advantage of him... books all people he feels he owes favors too, even though they don't benefit the biz and end up just eating up camera time.

I think another way is trimming the fat....I'm talking like shedding 1500+ pounds of battlers that don't really draw interest or have a fan base. Even if they aren't getting paid, time is still money
the dropped hfk...only 200 more pounds to go.
KebertXela is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 02:34 PM   #18
KebertXela
after school pottery star
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 926
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
KebertXela is not the worst person
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanillaNigga View Post
lmaoooo dead @ the thought of da rebel, organik, smack, and eurgh in a conference room discussing the next event...that would be amazing
Well, it's a well known fact, Nilla, that there's a secret society of the five wealthiest people in the world, known as The Pentaveret, who run everything in the world, including the newspapers, and meet tri annually at a secret country mansion in Colorado, known as The Meadows.
KebertXela is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 03:59 PM   #19
Neanderthol
Registered User
 
Neanderthol's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 2,373
Mentioned: 35 Post(s)
Neanderthol is better than Grind Time AustraliaNeanderthol is better than Grind Time AustraliaNeanderthol is better than Grind Time Australia
Whole bad scenario:
most of the "money grubbing" battlers are comprised of battlers that come from a league based in New York City where they can ask for anything for tickets and pack large venues so thats simple math-high tickets+large capacity= lots of money
this has allowed for some of the larger draws to demand more money and it is feasible thus giving that rapper an over-inflated view of his worth.(Lux,Mook,Hitman,Iron,etc...)

the other battlers concerned with money consist of people that feel they have contributed to this but missed the pay-out of it and are jealous of those aforementioned battlers (Math,Diz,ect...)
or cats that are too old to dedicate this amount of time to a task that is not a life-sustainable job.(Ness,Bigg K,Suge)

All of this =no solution

you end up with ridiculous shit like the other day where Math was telling Ganik how he should turn his 2 day 20 battle events into i day 6 battle events as if he knows better than the niggas who beeeeeeen doin this
I wouldn't book Math no more just off the strength of that alone but the fact remains that NY is an anomaly and has no relevance in reality
You should battle rap for the love of it,
if you can get some money- great,if you get a lot-fantastic (kinda like regular music has been for the last 10 years), but it shouldn't the a deciding factor on whether you do it or not unless you come to the "aha moment" that some money is better than no money and that if this is "what you do" then you should probably take the offers you get and "do it"
just tax ole Smack when you get to next chance

Lux really fucked they head up wit dis shit

Last edited by Neanderthol; 04-03-2014 at 04:06 PM.
Neanderthol is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 04:26 PM   #20
GetPaid
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 1,620
Mentioned: 17 Post(s)
GetPaid is better than Grind Time AustraliaGetPaid is better than Grind Time Australia
Hyphy>>>
GetPaid is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 05:12 PM   #21
Mr.Mumbles905
Battle Rapper
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,209
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Mr.Mumbles905 is a PY Poster
I think leagues need to find more income sources for the product they have. If leagues rerelease old footage in new formats. Like DVD of certain events and stuff where they don't need to pay the rapper Or best of X rapper videos like SNL does of old sketches


Plus they can follow the UFC model. You pay for who's actually bringing in tickets and whos getting views for main event. And the undercard gets filled with the best you can afford. The events like Blackout are not really profitable.

I've also thought maybe looking at paying rappers on a scale based on the views they bring in.


For local rappers who are undercard make them sell tickets to prove they are bringing people in as well they earn some cash
Mr.Mumbles905 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 05:53 PM   #22
Mr.Mumbles905
Battle Rapper
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,209
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Mr.Mumbles905 is a PY Poster
Quote:
Originally Posted by My Kall View Post
A publicly limited corporation could turn Battle-Rap into a cash-cow, and it would be like the TV industry/music industry. Independently Battle-Rap could be sustainable, here's some ideas how:

KOTD/Don't Flop/URL, as independent leagues, could:
- Charge MUCH higher ticket prices.
- Charge people to franchise the league's name and branding.
- Pay battlers less, use more up & comers, like Ty Law, who won't demand as much money.
- Stop flying so many people across the country or internationally, focus on cultivating local talent.
- Learn your market demographics, and then solicit sponsors, who are targeting those audiences. (part of the problem is that battle-rap might not be watched by one definitive demographic)
- Do more one-off battles at other peoples events, maybe go to some kind of entertainment exhibition or Hip-Hop festival.
- Sell some high view videos that are no longer getting many views, basically flog them for more than they're worth.

With the new profits, they should buy some non-current assets. If they made these purchases, banks would lend them credit no problem, AND if they needed to quickly raise cash they could sell them, maybe for more than they paid for depending on inflation rates.

The sustainability of it partly depends on where the league owners and staff live. If they live in poor small towns, they won't need as much money to spend on living costs, BUT if the owners live in places like NYC or London, then they'll have to withdraw as much of the profit as they can just to get by. I would suggest moving to cheaper towns.

Good ideas
Franchising KOTD is kind of doing it with the tour. I believe you pay to bring KOTD to your town and its an event hosted by Organik and stuff
Def local talent push easiest for Dont Flop
All the leagues saying sponsors aint messing with battle rap to tough which confuses me

The one offs ideas is a great idea. A cool way to open the show a one off battle

I don't think charging MUCH higher will work unless you bringing the maineventers in. These guys are doing 30-50 to 100 tickets sometimes

I guess GT kind of was close to franchising as well



Use the brand for more than just battling.
Mr.Mumbles905 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 05:56 PM   #23
Mr.Mumbles905
Battle Rapper
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,209
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Mr.Mumbles905 is a PY Poster
Quote:
Originally Posted by My Kall View Post
Another possibility would be for KOTD/URL/UW/Flip-Top/Don't Flop to merge into one huge independent organization. This would integrate all the markets, and banks would be MUCH more confident about lending credit to a diversified amalgamation of businesses, because if one brand was failing, another brand might be succeeding.
I've thought that they could do this for sponsors. Imagine if all the leagues approach a airline and say if you give us 60% discount on flights we fly hundreds of people around the world a year You can be known in the circle as the official battle rap airline. All official flights

You do the same for hotel chains as well
Mr.Mumbles905 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 06:12 PM   #24
Vanilla
Original RMBVA Dondatta
 
Vanilla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 4,021
Mentioned: 729 Post(s)
Vanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time Antarctica
Quote:
Originally Posted by KebertXela View Post
the dropped hfk...only 200 more pounds to go.
hahahahaha true enough.... almost there
__________________
http://i60.tinypic.com/15gaz6f.jpg

Quote:
Originally Posted by OrganikHipHop View Post
after all of this.. yall will still call us hill billys downplay our role and our history... but it aint gonna change shit
Vanilla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 06:19 PM   #25
My Kall
Registered User
 
My Kall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 3,474
Mentioned: 76 Post(s)
My Kall is better than Grind Time AustraliaMy Kall is better than Grind Time Australia
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Mumbles905 View Post
I think leagues need to find more income sources for the product they have. If leagues rerelease old footage in new formats. Like DVD of certain events and stuff where they don't need to pay the rapper Or best of X rapper videos like SNL does of old sketches


Plus they can follow the UFC model. You pay for who's actually bringing in tickets and whos getting views for main event. And the undercard gets filled with the best you can afford. The events like Blackout are not really profitable.

I've also thought maybe looking at paying rappers on a scale based on the views they bring in.


For local rappers who are undercard make them sell tickets to prove they are bringing people in as well they earn some cash
Selling DVDs will fail. Firstly the footage is already on You-Tube, so why would anyone buy it? Secondly if anyone did buy it they'd upload it You-Tube, and then the original videos on the league channel would lose views, as people will go to the pirated video.

A better idea would be for the leagues to create a service for You-Tube vloggers or entertainers to upload their videos to the KOTD/URL/Don't Flop channels, and take advantage of the subscribership, on the grounds that they pay a fee.

Maybe the leagues could do social work in the local communities, and bargain for government subsidies.

I think the battle leagues already implement the wage policy you suggested. Only the upper percentiles of battlers get paid. Personally I would just stop employing so many expensive battlers, because a lot of the time they aren't even better or much more view grabbing/ticket sales generating than people who'll battle for a hundred dollars or a plane flight, or even for free.
My Kall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 06:20 PM   #26
KebertXela
after school pottery star
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 926
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
KebertXela is not the worst person
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Mumbles905 View Post
I think leagues need to find more income sources for the product they have. If leagues rerelease old footage in new formats. Like DVD of certain events and stuff where they don't need to pay the rapper Or best of X rapper videos like SNL does of old sketches


Plus they can follow the UFC model. You pay for who's actually bringing in tickets and whos getting views for main event. And the undercard gets filled with the best you can afford. The events like Blackout are not really profitable.

I've also thought maybe looking at paying rappers on a scale based on the views they bring in.

For local rappers who are undercard make them sell tickets to prove they are bringing people in as well they earn some cash
-Name the rappers who enough quality/classic battles in just one league where it would be worth compiling all of those. KOTD won't share with URL or DF and vice versa. The BOTB series avo was doing was cool because their were great events. Not many events have been that great overall where you could sell every battle.

-How do you really know who is bringing in the customers? What if I am there for 7 battlers. Do they all get 1/7th of my ticket?

-Thats all subjective and it has been proven views can be bought. Plus there are some classic battles that are criminally slept on.

-Make all the rappers sell tickets then. Why put it on some guy with a small fan base to try and bring in large numbers.

I think until everyone stops viewing this as a hobby it can be monetized. Until then, I agree, do it cause you love it, you get to travel and you get some spending cash.
KebertXela is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 06:47 PM   #27
hawaiiand
Media
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 127
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
hawaiiand is a PY Poster
I have said this before so wont bore everyone again with too much text, but I dont think the endgame for battle rap 'industry' success has to do with pushing the cost to the consumer, rather move all leagues to a more production studio type of role and have a single 'network' publish the videos to view for free online on a proprietary video server. I think you cut Google/YouTube and their ad-revenue model out of the equation, let the network sell the ad space and pay the leagues directly for the content. Not so different than a television network paying for production studios to produce content. I don't think any single league today could accomplish all that (not enough content, not a large enough subscriber-ship), but if multiple leagues partnered with a single network for publishing, it could absolutely work.
hawaiiand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 07:40 PM   #28
My Kall
Registered User
 
My Kall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 3,474
Mentioned: 76 Post(s)
My Kall is better than Grind Time AustraliaMy Kall is better than Grind Time Australia
Removing videos from You-Tube would take a lot of getting used to. You-Tube's so successful because it's consistent, accessible, quick and easy to surf on. Videos on alternative outlets never stream as smoothly, they're clunky, they don't have such convenient search mechanisms, and the adverts are more intrusive.

I think a lot of people watch battles, because You-Tube makes them so unavoidably visible, via suggestion boxes, Facebook shares etc, and only committed fans like us would tolerate the new obstacles, and show the initiative to search for the battles, that are suddenly less readily available. People don't like even minor changes, which is evidenced by the collapse of RapMusic.com.

How are the leagues gonna get new fans, or re-awaken old fans, if their "go-to place" for battles, no longer distribute the videos?

And if the views did decline you'd lose sponsorship opportunities and power. Maybe if the videos were on World-Star, instead of You-Tube, it would work, but Word Star/Hip-Hop DX don't have the capacity or desire to share every video.
My Kall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 07:51 PM   #29
JustJ123
Registered User
 
JustJ123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 4,011
Mentioned: 29 Post(s)
JustJ123 is better than Grind Time AntarcticaJustJ123 is better than Grind Time AntarcticaJustJ123 is better than Grind Time Antarctica
I think battle rap would be in a better place than it is now if round times weren't so long and rematches were used better/possible.

Long rounds screws everything up and there isn't a large enough base of quality battlers. I feel like events can't be put on often enough to really make a profit, or get some real momentum going. And rematches aren't really an option.

Long rounds ruin rematch potential imo. At least most of them. Or it requires a huge amount of time.

Someone could lose a battle and battle the person again a month later(like UFC does) but when a battle is 60 minutes no one is trying to see that shit.

There is also a lot less to be said. Not that everything has or ever will be said in battle rap. But certain things are stale that could still be fresh if battles weren't as long ast hey are.
__________________
http://i.imgur.com/gj02Ups.jpg
Fucking herbivore you're nerd for sure
JustJ123 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 08:28 PM   #30
hawaiiand
Media
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 127
Mentioned: 12 Post(s)
hawaiiand is a PY Poster
Quote:
Originally Posted by My Kall View Post
Removing videos from You-Tube would take a lot of getting used to. You-Tube's so successful because it's consistent, accessible, quick and easy to surf on. Videos on alternative outlets never stream as smoothly, they're clunky, they don't have such convenient search mechanisms, and the adverts are more intrusive.

I think a lot of people watch battles, because You-Tube makes them so unavoidably visible, via suggestion boxes, Facebook shares etc, and only committed fans like us would tolerate the new obstacles, and show the initiative to search for the battles, that are suddenly less readily available. People don't like even minor changes, which is evidenced by the collapse of RapMusic.com.

How are the leagues gonna get new fans, or re-awaken old fans, if their "go-to place" for battles, no longer distribute the videos?

And if the views did decline you'd lose sponsorship opportunities and power. Maybe if the videos were on World-Star, instead of You-Tube, it would work, but Word Star/Hip-Hop DX don't have the capacity or desire to share every video.
Agreed. I meant the 'endgame', but there are a lot of steps in my mind to get to that point and still be at least sustaining the current successes.
hawaiiand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 08:45 PM   #31
Casual
Registered User
 
Casual's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 10,402
Mentioned: 451 Post(s)
Casual is a vet in their local leagueCasual is a vet in their local leagueCasual is a vet in their local leagueCasual is a vet in their local leagueCasual is a vet in their local leagueCasual is a vet in their local leagueCasual is a vet in their local leagueCasual is a vet in their local leagueCasual is a vet in their local leagueCasual is a vet in their local league
No.

When has anyone ever got paid off this shit? Arsonal is the closest thing to someone who's actually making moves off battle rap, but he uses it far more as a promotional tool than anyhting. And let's be honest, the dudes basically still living in the hood. What's the end goal? It's not like you can have a long career...it doesn't exactly put you in a position to go in a different direction when you're done. It's great if you want to barely make ends meet while living in a cheap ass area (new orleans for example).

Lux got 40k...that's nice. How long did he have to hold out for that to happen? Like 6 years? He could have made double that working at McDonalds. It only seems like a lot cause it was a lump sum, considering the time it took to get that it's less than minimum wage.

The leagues barely stay afloat. If they're lucky they'll make enough money that it's not a loss for them.

The fans don't help either cause the demographic it appeals to isn't exactly some sort of high income one.

Battle rap will continue to exist because there will always be people passionate about it that are willing to sacrifice a few years of their life (or are delusional enough to think it'll blow up) but outside of a few people there's always gonna be a huge turnover of battlers/leagues.

Ganik says battlers should see KOTD as a promotional platform for themselves, but the problem is most of them have absolutely nothing to promote anyway. A couple people make good music...there's guys like Charron who are grinding and living pretty nice right now...but when i say pretty nice i say it in the context of a dude that just graduated high school.

Pat Stays right...go get a college degree. You don't wanna be pete.

Last edited by Casual; 04-03-2014 at 08:50 PM.
Casual is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2014, 09:10 PM   #32
Jaybird
Registered User
 
Jaybird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2013
Posts: 712
Mentioned: 15 Post(s)
Jaybird is not the worst person
@hawaiiand is the bastard son of Nicky Barnes and Griselda Blanco- true facts.
Jaybird is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2014, 03:01 AM   #33
Vanilla
Original RMBVA Dondatta
 
Vanilla's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 4,021
Mentioned: 729 Post(s)
Vanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time AntarcticaVanilla is better than Grind Time Antarctica
@organik hiphop see the people do care!
__________________
http://i60.tinypic.com/15gaz6f.jpg

Quote:
Originally Posted by OrganikHipHop View Post
after all of this.. yall will still call us hill billys downplay our role and our history... but it aint gonna change shit
Vanilla is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2014, 03:03 AM   #34
StabYourself
Seasoned Fan
 
StabYourself's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: 831
Posts: 3,777
Mentioned: 337 Post(s)
StabYourself is better than Grind Time AntarcticaStabYourself is better than Grind Time AntarcticaStabYourself is better than Grind Time AntarcticaStabYourself is better than Grind Time Antarctica
Quote:
Originally Posted by VanillaNigga View Post
@organik hiphop see the people do care!
What do you mean "the people"?




















...D:
StabYourself is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2014, 11:00 AM   #35
Mr.Mumbles905
Battle Rapper
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,209
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Mr.Mumbles905 is a PY Poster
Quote:
Originally Posted by KebertXela View Post
-Name the rappers who enough quality/classic battles in just one league where it would be worth compiling all of those. KOTD won't share with URL or DF and vice versa. The BOTB series avo was doing was cool because their were great events. Not many events have been that great overall where you could sell every battle.

-How do you really know who is bringing in the customers? What if I am there for 7 battlers. Do they all get 1/7th of my ticket?

-Thats all subjective and it has been proven views can be bought. Plus there are some classic battles that are criminally slept on.

-Make all the rappers sell tickets then. Why put it on some guy with a small fan base to try and bring in large numbers.

I think until everyone stops viewing this as a hobby it can be monetized. Until then, I agree, do it cause you love it, you get to travel and you get some spending cash.
KOTD could do the best of PatStay Hollohan Pesci Charron etc...
They could do best of World Domination like they did BOTB or the best of BlackOut


URL can do Summer Madness or the best of like Rex Math etc..

Plus URL is sitting on mad footage probobly even from the Smack DVD's doing nothing

A company needs to know the buzz of there product to know who's name is really selling tickets and who's just filling out the card. Not really a science to it.


Making all the rappers sell tickets is fair but some rappers names are big enough they don't have too. It gives those with a lesser name a chance to make some money and prove there worth. Think about it like this. If you are on the bottom of the card right now you have no chance to make any money. But if you are a local cat who got allot of people to come out to event in support. Its not fair that only international guys and the league benefit from it.

If I'm on the card it gives me incentive to really push the event
Mr.Mumbles905 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2014, 11:04 AM   #36
Mr.Mumbles905
Battle Rapper
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 1,209
Mentioned: 33 Post(s)
Mr.Mumbles905 is a PY Poster
Quote:
Originally Posted by My Kall View Post
Selling DVDs will fail. Firstly the footage is already on You-Tube, so why would anyone buy it? Secondly if anyone did buy it they'd upload it You-Tube, and then the original videos on the league channel would lose views, as people will go to the pirated video.

A better idea would be for the leagues to create a service for You-Tube vloggers or entertainers to upload their videos to the KOTD/URL/Don't Flop channels, and take advantage of the subscribership, on the grounds that they pay a fee.

Maybe the leagues could do social work in the local communities, and bargain for government subsidies.

I think the battle leagues already implement the wage policy you suggested. Only the upper percentiles of battlers get paid. Personally I would just stop employing so many expensive battlers, because a lot of the time they aren't even better or much more view grabbing/ticket sales generating than people who'll battle for a hundred dollars or a plane flight, or even for free.
How did the BOTB stuff do? Did that get released online.
Mr.Mumbles905 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2014, 02:33 PM   #37
aeroseth
Registered User
 
aeroseth's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: 045 / 074
Posts: 660
Mentioned: 3 Post(s)
aeroseth is not the worst person
Quote:
Originally Posted by KebertXela View Post
the dropped hfk...only 200 more pounds to go.
DEAD !! take this rep bruv
aeroseth is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2014, 02:48 PM   #38
GASP
Trollin Trolled
 
GASP's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 852
Mentioned: 39 Post(s)
GASP is a PY Poster
Quote:
Originally Posted by KebertXela View Post
the dropped hfk...only 200 more pounds to go.
I'm pretty sure they didn't, I haven't felt a tsunami
GASP is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2014, 04:03 PM   #39
My Kall
Registered User
 
My Kall's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 3,474
Mentioned: 76 Post(s)
My Kall is better than Grind Time AustraliaMy Kall is better than Grind Time Australia
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.Mumbles905 View Post
How did the BOTB stuff do? Did that get released online.
I dunno. Another way the leagues could make money off their footage would be to sell an app that allowed viewers to download a specific round or segment of a battle, into a playlist.
My Kall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-04-2014, 08:28 PM   #40
Sky2real
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 2,926
Mentioned: 45 Post(s)
Sky2real is better than Grind Time AustraliaSky2real is better than Grind Time Australia
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ness Lee View Post
from the looks of things battle rap has a terrible business model.

organizers complain about the money they get. battlers complain about the money they get. who is getting the money?
Lux.
Sky2real is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

 
Forum Stats
Members: 5,477
Threads: 26,416
Posts: 724,673
Total Online: 1098

Newest Member: questionmaster

Latest Threads
- by iamHBY
- by iamHBY
- by iamHBY
- by iamHBY
- by ledge
- by All Day
- by iamHBY



All times are GMT. The time now is 06:54 PM.